There is nothing wrong with actually rescuing a dog from a horrible breeder. That's how Val has gotten her 2 Chis. The problem lies with purchasing a puppy from someone who is not breeding responsibly simply because you want to save the puppy. In that moment you are no different from the people buying the pretty puppy without a second thought. 5 weeks is way too young, and is illegal in some states.

Tiff&Kya wrote:

Koda wrote:

How is that EVER going to change unless we stop them?? I'm sorry, while I understand the pity we all have for these puppies, that way of thinking is rather naive. If the dogs are being mistreated, call the ASPCA or animal control. PURCHASING a dog from these people is adding to the problem.

Please don't be a part of the problem.

I would rather rescue a dog than have it shot at 3 years of age bc the BYB has no use for it anymore. I have never purchased a puppy from one, but I just can't let dogs suffer because of the ignorance of people.

And that's what I am arguing against. Don't purchase a puppy from one. Like Kristina said (thank you, Kristina), there is nothing wrong with rescuing a puppy from a bad breeder... the problem lies in purchasing one.

And it IS naive to believe that you are helping the problem by *purchasing* a dog from a BYB. I'm not denying that it's all with good intentions, but giving these people money is just encouraging them to do it again.

hypers987 wrote:

I got Kale at five weeks with almost the same conditions that you are describing. He was bred poorly and now has muscular-skeletal issues; I would not wish that or any other ailment on anyone. These people breed to get easy money, not to better the breed. Skip this BYB and try and find a reputable show breeder; you may have to wait for a litter, but it'll be worth it. Try this - http://www.akc.org/classified/ And click "Search Classified Listing"

Welcome to the forum BTW

That classified is pretty much all BYB's too unfortunately. A better source is the Siberian Husky Club of America's breeder referral list: http://www.shca.org/shcahp4f.htm

I also agree with not supporting a BYB. They won't stop until they end up not being able to sell the puppies quickly and have 5 6 month old huskies running around tearing up their house unable to find them homes still.

Koda wrote:

Tiff&Kya wrote:

Koda wrote:

How is that EVER going to change unless we stop them?? I'm sorry, while I understand the pity we all have for these puppies, that way of thinking is rather naive. If the dogs are being mistreated, call the ASPCA or animal control. PURCHASING a dog from these people is adding to the problem.

Please don't be a part of the problem.

I would rather rescue a dog than have it shot at 3 years of age bc the BYB has no use for it anymore. I have never purchased a puppy from one, but I just can't let dogs suffer because of the ignorance of people.

And that's what I am arguing against. Don't purchase a puppy from one. Like Kristina said (thank you, Kristina), there is nothing wrong with rescuing a puppy from a bad breeder... the problem lies in purchasing one.

And it IS naive to believe that you are helping the problem by *purchasing* a dog from a BYB. I'm not denying that it's all with good intentions, but giving these people money is just encouraging them to do it again.

Well, like I said, I haven't purchased a puppy from a BYB, only took 3 ADULTS that were going to be shot. That is an entirely acceptable thing to do, no matter where they came from.

I may just be a bleeding heart, and I hope on one is thinking I'm being rude or anything, but I can't in my heart, see something that I know is wrong and let it happen without trying to stop it. Mind you, I would threaten to report and make them give the dog to a rescue or something, but I would not NOT do anything.

I got Kale at five weeks and he is just fine, but I had to work with him every second of every day. It was a 24/7 job. I'm not condoning EVER getting a puppy that young, or supporting BYBs by any means. I did what I did and I'm living with the consequences. (saving up for a $400 CT scan for his left front shoulder/elbow + 200 in xrays that I just had done, not including the anesthesia and meds). If you do decide to get this pup, realize the potential for possible life-long genetic issues (Kale's didn't show up till he was 9 months). I'd rather adopt, and save a life in that manner, than purchase from someone that breeds only to make a profit.

Tiff&Kya wrote:

Well, like I said, I haven't purchased a puppy from a BYB, only took 3 ADULTS that were going to be shot. That is an entirely acceptable thing to do, no matter where they came from.

I may just be a bleeding heart, and I hope on one is thinking I'm being rude or anything, but I can't in my heart, see something that I know is wrong and let it happen without trying to stop it. Mind you, I would threaten to report and make them give the dog to a rescue or something, but I would not NOT do anything.

My original comment was directed at your encouragement of the OP to purchase a BYB dog. I'm not saying that you personally are a part of the problem (although it was ambiguous at first as to whether or not you had purchased your rescues or just got them out of a bad home).

And no one here is saying they want to sit idly by and watch wrong-doing happen. In fact, I think we ALL are saying that we can't and won't. The problem is that the solution isn't paying a BYB for a puppy they should never have created. And while many of these dogs go on to be fantastic pets, their existence is killing a dog who did find its way into a shelter and couldn't find a home.

All I'm saying is that there are better solutions than encouraging the OP to purchase a dog that is likely going to have a really rough start in life and whose breeders are only out for the money.

Tiffany- No one is saying what you did is wrong! Don't worry! Rescuing a dog or puppy from a BYB (i.e. not giving them money for it) is fine and a good thing to do! It's forking over $700 to "rescue" a puppy that's a bad thing. Trust me, we did that with Siku and her breeder quickly realized husky puppies are money makers and now she has about 20+ breeding females! She cranks out tons of puppies, because people will buy them. She usually has at least 2 litters listed on her site all the time. I bet she had over 200 puppies just last year alone. It's a really sick cycle.

SaraB wrote:

Tiffany- No one is saying what you did is wrong! Don't worry! Rescuing a dog or puppy from a BYB (i.e. not giving them money for it) is fine and a good thing to do! It's forking over $700 to "rescue" a puppy that's a bad thing. Trust me, we did that with Siku and her breeder quickly realized husky puppies are money makers and now she has about 20+ breeding females! She cranks out tons of puppies, because people will buy them. She usually has at least 2 litters listed on her site all the time. I bet she had over 200 puppies just last year alone. It's a really sick cycle.

That is sick, and that's the way this lady was. She had LITERALLY 100 breeding dogs, from min pins, to maltese, yorkies and poms. We went to pick up the girls bc she gave us 48 hours before they were going to die, and we walked into the yard and was horrified. Literally, her doggie door was just a stream of dogs. We couldn't go inside, SURPRISE SURPRISE and we had to wait in the wet while she bathed the poms bc they were covered in feces.

I originally went to get just one, bc she said that she just needed to find a home for her, that she worked and her husband was tired of them and was going to shoot them, never said she was a breeder, and then was shown 3, and took all three of them.

I don't agree with paying money for the puppy, I only said what I thought was best for the dog in the long run. I wish we were able to stop them, but sadly, in Texas it is only getting worse as areas like Austin, and Dallas put in place laws that pet shops can not sell pups under 6 months old and breeders must be registered and unless they are going to be show dogs, must be spayed/nuetered before they leave. These are great laws, but are leading to more BYB.


I know that not all are as bad as that, and that is technically a puppy mill, but that is why I was saying to get the puppy. I can't believe that people do this, and I may be a bit naive to think I can save everyone, but atleast it keeps me going.

I did not mean to sound rude or abrasive in any way

Tiff&Kya wrote:

I did not mean to sound rude or abrasive in any way

You didn't

And my apologies if I came off that way as well. I just can't condone encouraging a purchase from these people... as heartbreaking as it is to see needy animals. The sad truth is that we can't save them all.. and if we tried... well, watch an episode or two of Animal Hoarders and you'll see what happens when good intentioned people try to save them all...

Koda wrote:

Tiff&Kya wrote:

I did not mean to sound rude or abrasive in any way

You didn't

And my apologies if I came off that way as well. I just can't condone encouraging a purchase from these people... as heartbreaking as it is to see needy animals. The sad truth is that we can't save them all.. and if we tried... well, watch an episode or two of Animal Hoarders and you'll see what happens when good intentioned people try to save them all...

Haha. Yeah. I watch that show all the time, and then feel the need to clean my house extremely well even though I only have 4 animals LOL.

Instead of hoping and telling people to not purchase from a BYB. Why don't we make the rules harder for a BYB so hard that it would not be worth it for them to breed. There are a lot of us on this forum from different states and some countries. Everyone in this forum also has groups of people they know that live around them. Well except for me I am a hermit...lol
We can write letters to our congress men/ people. A lot of you go to dog parks you socialize with other pet owners, have get together find who are the bad BYB and get AC or who ever involved. Maybe put out flyers to educated people on BYB. A lot of people are clueless.
I think you all know what I am talking about. As long as easy for them they will keep doing no matter who buys the dogs.
ok I am done... sorry

If you want a puppy, I can heartily recommend these breeders in the Seattle area:
Syntari in Maple Valley (http://www.syntari.com/)
and Poku in Centralia (http://pokusiberians.com/)
Both have puppies now or soon will have them.

I went to a dog show, met Andrea (Poku) and she directed me to Jamesa (Syntari) who had Bodhi, that I rehomed. Both of these women are wonderful, ethical breeders with beautiful dogs.

Also Washington has a bunch of Siberian rescue organizations (http://www.siberianrescue.com/west.htm#Washington),
if you are willing to take a chance on an older dog.

I did and I hit the jackpot with Bodhi.

The Idaho breeder I contacted sold his last puppy yesterday, so I'll definitely look into these breeders. Thanks!

We all do a lot of those things, Deb. Trust me... we are all on the same page with the frustration out there. But like Tiffany said, sometimes these laws that we ask for only create more BYBs.

Great suggestions, Michael!

So it looks like that BYB breeder I contacted a few days ago isn't responding anymore. No additional pictures were ever sent to me...her ad is all over eBay and Craigslist now.

But on the bright side, after contacting Andrea at Poku, it looks like we'll be adopting one of the five males born on Feb. 27th! I will post pictures and possibly a short video after our visit to their kennel in early April. Thanks for the referral, Michael!

Aww

http://pokusiberians.com/494.html

AH they are so cute..

I wish you good luck on getting a cutie. (which they all are).

Aww!! They are all adorable! Do you know what color you're leaning towards?

yay for getting a pup!! So glad you didn't go to the BYB. I went to a breeder (who just wanted to breed the dogs to keep one of the pups, total lover of the breed) for maggie but only paid 200 for an AKC malamute! I have paperwork and everything. I was kinda worried I wouldn't get her because I had no experience.

norbreedslove wrote:

(who just wanted to breed the dogs to keep one of the pups, total lover of the breed)

I am NOT trying to start an argument, but purely for education's sake... in the dog world, that is still considered a BYB. A "reputable breeder" in the dog world is considered someone who breeds at appropriate ages and times, breeds only healthy and health tested dogs, and does so PURELY for the reason of showing/working and bettering the breed. That's a loose definition that we can clearly add to, but those are the foundations of a reputable breeder. Anything else is normally considered a puppy mill or a BYB depending on the specifics.

^ Don't forget one curcial point, will take back any puppy at any point in its life if need be. I don't respect any breeder who won't.

Quote :

A "reputable breeder" in the dog world is considered someone who breeds at appropriate ages and times, breeds only healthy and health tested dogs, and does so PURELY for the reason of showing/working and bettering the breed.

Mine wasn't even this sketchy. I saw the parents
Actually thats what I meant to put. This is what my breeder was doing. They wanted another dog to mush or show. Maggie's parents were from working and show lines. I have the paperwork, and health records from the parents, and am in contact with all the puppies owners. I did my research and the breeder up here that I was going to get a pup from recommended them.

Also, another point. Maggie's brothers owner wanted to get rid of them, they contacted the breeder and the breeder took the dogs back. I think one of the rescues down in so cal found them both good homes.

and at this point who cares, my dog is mine and she is in an amazing home!

jalepeno wrote:

If you want a puppy, I can heartily recommend these breeders in the Seattle area:
Syntari in Maple Valley (http://www.syntari.com/)
and Poku in Centralia (http://pokusiberians.com/)
Both have puppies now or soon will have them.

I went to a dog show, met Andrea (Poku) and she directed me to Jamesa (Syntari) who had Bodhi, that I rehomed. Both of these women are wonderful, ethical breeders with beautiful dogs.

Also Washington has a bunch of Siberian rescue organizations (http://www.siberianrescue.com/west.htm#Washington),
if you are willing to take a chance on an older dog.

I did and I hit the jackpot with Bodhi.

You sure did. He's a beautiful dog!! And seems like a real charmer

JSitthi wrote:

So it looks like that BYB breeder I contacted a few days ago isn't responding anymore. No additional pictures were ever sent to me...her ad is all over eBay and Craigslist now.

But on the bright side, after contacting Andrea at Poku, it looks like we'll be adopting one of the five males born on Feb. 27th! I will post pictures and possibly a short video after our visit to their kennel in early April. Thanks for the referral, Michael!

Aww

http://pokusiberians.com/494.html

That's cool!

norbreedslove wrote:

yay for getting a pup!! So glad you didn't go to the BYB. I went to a breeder (who just wanted to breed the dogs to keep one of the pups, total lover of the breed) for maggie but only paid 200 for an AKC malamute! I have paperwork and everything. I was kinda worried I wouldn't get her because I had no experience.

This is pretty similar situation to how I got Nike. I didnt know what a BYB even was until like a week ago. I have all my papers and got her for 400(I think thats good?). It looks like the lines were severely overbred, but they let us see the parents multiple times and even had weekly skype sessions with the pup unitl we drove and got her .

I have Nike now and wouldnt want any other husky